"Walking on Eggshells"
“What does it say that people would prefer to kill themselves than serve this sentence. That goes against everything that the justice system should be set up for. “ ~ MarkConway, IPP prisoner on licence
Listen to Trapped Episode 8: Walking on Eggshells
If you missed Episode 7: Appealing the Sentence (because I failed to post it, soz) listen here
What is it like for people on licence from their IPP sentence? Mark Conway and Andrew Morris both describe it as like ‘walking on eggshells’.
Mark Conway says the parole process for IPPs starts from the very first day that you walk into prison. In 2019 he intervened in the terror attack at London Bridge, tackling Usman Khan who was subsequently shot dead by armed police. Mark's first call was to his parole officer because he was worried he might get recalled to prison for breaching his licence conditions.
Andrew Morris says he is frustrated at the lack of will to finally bring change and the needless deaths of IPPs, one being ‘Danny’ whom he knew in prison and whose death Andrew describes as "inexcusable and unforgivable that his life has been lost as a result of a system that chooses not to correct itself because it wants to be defiant to the end." Both Mark and Andrew are resilient and articulate about the IPP sentence and its effects, which only highlights how it has broken so many other people.
We speak to criminologist Sophie Ellis who worked for the prison service for 10 years about the prisoner, psychologist relationship and her complicated feelings about having been part of administering the IPP sentence. Outside of prison, the relationship between a patient and therapist is built on trust. But as Sophie highlights, IPPs serving prisoners know that any trust they have with their therapist is more conditional, as ultimately the psychologists are there to do risk assessments and act as an arm of the prison service, a system which is built to contain them. When explaining the IPP to members of the public she finds that people struggle to psychologically comprehend that it exists and that it interferes with people's sense of natural justice.
We also get an update on the political situation and Secretary of State for Justice, Alex Chalk's current thinking on IPPs.
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For more info about the Campaigns for Justice for IPPs prisoners go to: UNGRIPP Twitter @UNGRIPP and IPP Committee In Action Twitter @ActionIPP